055) In Search of 17-beta-HSD-3 Blockers OR Life's Easy When

Printer-friendly version

Author: 

Blog About: 

Taxonomy upgrade extras: 

As many of you are probably aware I've doing HRT DIY-style.

I've gotten my dosages and scheduling and everything pretty well perfected except for ONE THING. One of my three T blockers is making me tired all the time.

I'm using three different herbs to help eliminate testosterone from my body: Saw palmetto, which blocks 5-alpha-Reductase, the enzyme responsible for manufacturing dihydrotestosterone from testosterone, DHT being 3 to 10 times stronger than T. Spearmint which binds to androgen receptor sites preventing stronger androgens from doing so whilst not actually producing any androgenic effect at all. And finally, the troublemaker: Chinese Skullcap.

Chinese skullcap works by blocking 17-beta-HSD types 3 and 1. It blocks type 3 much more strongly than type 1 which is why I feel justified in using it despite it also blocking type 1. Too strongly blocking type 1 is undesirable, that's the type that's responsible for reducing estrone to estradiol, and a buildup of estrone can lead to many problems...

Blocking type 3 is what I'm using it for. Type 3 is the type primarily responsible for manufacturing testosterone from weaker androgens... By blocking JUST the testosterone synthesis pathway selectively I avoid many of the problems of less selective T-blocking methods, making it easier to control and "DIY" without medical oversight.

The problem is that over time abuse of chinese skullcap can, in some individuals, lead to stomach cramping, a loose bowel and excessive drowsiness. I appear to be one of those individuals. At first I felt great using CS. But months later I'm getting all the side effects warned about.

I do NOT want to resort to spironolactone. While it does the job of all three of my herbs, it also does things that are unnecessary, and things I'm using other things for, and could potentially STILL have the same side effects. I put spiro in the same category, but as an even worse offender, as licorice. It's even worse because it's entirely synthetic, a man-made chemical drug with no natural analog. And it's still a sledge-hammer to your insides. Licorice may be a sledge-hammer to your insides, but at least it's a natural one ;)

So yeah. I'm on the prowl for something else to use. Hopefully which only blocks types 3 and 5, three being preferred. Type 5 is ALSO responsible for testosterone production, but not nearly to the extent that type 3 is. If it blocks any other types, hopefully it does so very weakly in comparison.

My resources however, are limited. I have access to enough information to know that what I'm after is out there, but precisely which herb I want goes a little deeper into the medical research papers than I can get my claws into. I am using CS because, despite the potential side effects, it was the only one I could actually get the name of. But I know there are others. And hopefully at least one of which won't have side effects I won't be able to manage on my own. I honestly never would have expected CS's side effects to be THIS strong. The drowsiness I can fight. The cramping and loose bowel I can not seem to do so.

If anyone can help I'd appreciate it... Otherwise... I just needed to vent some frustration.

In other news...

I am really doing pretty well overall. For the most part I am no longer being sirred or having any other reference to being male made in reference to my person any more. There are the few very rude exceptions among mostly strangers, and those who already knew me are struggling but really are trying now. Well. Those who didn't immediately end contact with me when I came out to them. I still have not heard from my once dearest sister. And I suspect I never will.

I say very rude because except for just ONE THING my daily appearance is extremely feminine now... That one thing being the remnants of my beard that is just too dark to cover without painting on way too much makeup for my preferences.

One of these days that problem will be gone... Still need to shave my entire bloody body every day as well, but yeah. Soon as my face is completely done, I'll have them start my back, and I'll buy an at-home laser hair removal device to use on everything I can reach myself.

Though I still haven't quite worked up my nerve to go to my bike shop... And my one friend from high school hasn't been spoken to since before... I'm really danged nervous on both counts. The guys at the shop are really excessively macho types and the high school friend... Well... He was the only person in high school who even really wanted to try to be my friend. How do you tell someone like that that you aren't who they thought you were? And yeah. I kinda like him. And I was always sorely jealous of his sisters while at the same time actually wanting to hang with them more than him, which made me feel bad.

I still have my occasional doubts and fears, but then I look closely at what kind of life I'd been "living" and realize... Yeah. It might be rough right now, but a large part of that is that I'm even bothering to try. Life's easy when you aren't even trying.

Comments

Sorry, but...

Those are all phyto-estrogens. I am using a phyto-estrogen, but it's MUCH stronger than any of the ones you've used.

Pueraria Mirifica. 'T'ain't yer momma's phyto-estrogen. Trust me. LOL. I'm using that as a topical extract.

I'm also actually using estradiol valerate. It's the only non-herb or herb-extract I'm using right now and I kinda wanna keep it that way. But if going chemical is actually easier to self-regulate... I really won't hesitate to use what'll help me most.

My problem is that my T production is out of this world crazy insanely high and E alone is no where near enough. I need anti-androgens.

I am starting to strongly consider spiro though. It'll let me ditch about half my personal apothecary sitting on my nightstand. And God willing my only side effect of note will be what it was originally intended for: going pee more often. I can just introduce an anti-diuretic for that. Considering that in my case the lowered blood pressure and such are actually desirable, as long as I go off the other stuff I'm using for that. Or maybe just reduce doses.

I'd be able to eliminate all the rest of my anti-androgens, though I'd probably continue on a lower dose of spearmint because NOTHING is as effective as spearmint at disrupting hirsute body hair patterns. Which may not be directly causing me to lose as much body hair as I'd like it to, but I do believe it's what's making the laser so dang effective so quickly. I've only had 4 sessions on my neck so far and I barely have any hair left on my neck. I'm willing to bet that in two more sessions I may potentially have a hairless neck. With face and chin being next up to be taken care of.

I'd also be able to eliminate or reduce the need for CoQ10, butcher's broom, and rhodiola rosea, all of which fight things that spiro fights.

I could potentially also eliminate my dependance on energy supplements.

If I get any of the other potential side effects though... Grr...

So yeah. I'm not QUITE ready to jump to spiro just yet. And I'm VERY interested to learn more about other 17-beta-HSD-3 blockers FIRST. So that I can consider ALL my options.

Abigail Drew.

PLEASE BE CAREFULL!!!!!!!

In 20089 I was self administering HRT with Spironlactone and and almost killed myself. My potassium level when I finally went to the ER was 8.3! Doctors consider over 7 as potentially fatal. With 20/20 hindsight I know my organs had shut down. Since then I got a Endocrinologist and have super monitored my potassium levels.


GET A PHYSICIAN NOW!!!!!

Wish I could...

I'm NOT using spiro though. Not yet, and maybe not ever. I can assure you if I DID ever start using it I'd do my own monitoring of my potassium and sodium levels even IF I had a doctor. Doctors can't always be trusted in my experience and even if they can, something can happen when you aren't expecting it. You never know.

Chinese skullcap is an herb and it's NOTHING like spiro or even licorice. It DOES have a supposed toxic dose, but it's crazy high, and has nothing to do with it's effects but is directly due to the herb itself. Almost anything could potentially become dangerous... But CS is like apples and arsenic... The amount of the potentially toxic chemical in CS is so miniscule that you'd have to consume ridiculous amounts of the herb - well past ANY sensible limit, to have it occur.

The lethargy isn't actually an indication of ANYTHING wrong at all in this case. It's just one of the possible effects of the herb. It's annoying because it's unintended, but it's not dangerous. Just makes life a little harder to live.

Spearmint and saw palmetto have literally zero toxicity and saw palmetto does very little else EXCEPT block DHT. Spearmint has quite a few things attributed to it, yes, but not anything even annoying, let alone life threatening. Even if you're allergic most people's allergic response is a loose bowel.

Anyway. The other things the CS was doing seemed to only be temporary. Maybe it wasn't even CS at all. Maybe the lethargy I'm having isn't CS either. It only seems to be the most likely.

Then again, I am on like day nine of a cycle, maybe my simulation is starting to become a little too effective and I'm getting severe period symptoms? Cuz I am recovering now... Still lethargic though...

Abigail Drew.

adjustment of dosage

I am wondering what your criteria for adjust your dosages is, and what dosages you've arrived at. I've been interested in herbal HRT, but you seem to know much more than I could find out, back in the day.

Another thing that threw me was how varied the ratings for the herbal suppliers were, and how varied they were. Can you say what brands you've found effective?