Crossdresser Playground

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Kristina L S's picture

simple innit?

Well no, not really. It's sort of a double edged thingie in a way. The whole idea of censorship bothers me, has since I was a kid with only a vague idea of what it meant. So in that respect I can say, post the link and those interested go have fun, just don't expect to have a majority here asking for or interested in the details. Personally it doesn't interest me in the slightest and I suspect most that come here would feel similarly. Some may, for their own reasons seek such… fine and dandy, but again…

The other side of this little slightly moralistic coin is the simple fact that BC is NOT just another TG assorted story come fetish site. THAT is what sets it apart and is why most that come here do so. Okay some stories may push the edges now and then, hey why not. Some may say I have done so, sure I guess in a gentle way. But the fact remains that most participants here do not want to see, some of the things that are commonplace elsewhere. That is what elsewhere is for after all.

So while I understand Pippa's angst, I do in general terms support Erin. Likewise the 'doggy' story. A double post, the first pushing the edges a little, but fair enough, the second at basically the same time. No TG and a mildly subtle beastiality theme. Playing fast and loose with the accepted norms and hardly likely to endear a new author to the 'community' that is BC. If said author does not care, so be it. Don't expect Chrissy cards.

So… what does it all mean. Okay it all plays by the rules and who am I to tell Erin how to do anything, especially when in a general sense I agree with her. Still, the fact remains that BC is a different place and it is what it is for those reasons. It aint perfect, what is and as with any assorted group there will be hissy's and spats. But mostly those don't involve in ya face sex with or without animals. Gee I'm such a prude aint I.

Kristina

Erin's picture

Close enough

I don't want anyone to think that I don't understand the angst involved, I do. No one wants to see a place they've come to prefer to others changing into something else.

But from my view, I'm doing what I've always done. Neither of the two recent incidents involves any change in my policies. And I don't think either of them will change the overall tone of BC in any fundamental way. The balance has always been dynamic here.

Can anyone guess what sort of story I get the most complaints about? Serials.

Hugs to all,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Hope Eternal Reigns's picture

I don't like serials

Hi Erin,

In my opinion, if it isn't too great a faux pas to offer it, you have set an excellent policy as to the main topic here. Thank you for being so inclusive.

Oh and as to serials, I prefer a more substantial breakfast such as ham and eggs with hash-browns and toast.

with love,

Hope

with love,

Hope

Once in a while I bare my soul, more often my soles bear me.

A Little On The Hard-Core Side

I took a quick peek at the site, and my first impression is that it's primarily about sex, as in f*@#ing. F*@#ing while being crossdressed, f*@#ing while being gay, f*@#ing while being a sissy. Lots of sissy stuff seems to be emphasized. Upper right hand corner features a link to a "Humiliatrix".

Now, I'm not saying the other material isn't there, too, as in your description, but that's certainly not what pops out at you on the front page. The pictures shown on the front page are fairly naughty and a bit beyond what I would class as soft-core, and probably illegal in some places, perhaps Alabama. No immediately obvious close up of genitals, in action or otherwise. But plenty of partial nudity, posed in flagrante delecto, so to speak (however it's spelled.) Couldn't help noticing a photo of someone fellating a sex toy. Now, a disclaimer: I spent less than 15 seconds on the site, so if there's something naughtier there that I didn't notice, I wouldn't be surprised. This is not a comprehensive analysis.

So, I'd say it's not for us "vanilla" crossdressers, the ones who dress not to fulfill sexual fantasy or as a form of foreplay, but just for the feeling of calm, escape, to enjoy parts of our identity that don't get out to play often enough. I don't criticize those who personally find a link between sexuality and crossdressing or even "autogynephilia" (although I despise the value judgement that seems to accompany this cobbled-up term.) But, don't describe this site as primarily about crossdressing.

Just wanted to reply,,,,

HI, this is Betty, the owner of Crossdresser Playground. I'm sorry if my site seems to have offended some, but I thought that is why you have an "adult" category?? Just what did you expect to find in that type of section? I thought about putting it in the explicit section, but as someone pointed out I don't show real hardcore stuff.

I do however link to hardcore action. I admit a lot of the content is geared toward the adult side, but again that's why I put in it the adult section here. Half of my descriptions says "It also has many pictures and movies of an adult nature." So, that's what you see when you go to my site, no surprise there.

I joined here because I am planning to put in a "myspace" type of community to go along with my forum. I also am about to open a transgender stories section and game page. So, I was hoping to meet new girls here, and also write some stories to add to this site. I understand my ads and post are not for everyone and are of an adult nature. But, I assume that's why the adult section is here, and why I put it in there. Am I missing something?? Sorry to start off on the wrong foot.

Erin's picture

Not Spam

Your blog is not spam and not outside what is allowed here. It probably would have been better to put it up as a Link though, using the |+Link| thing at the top of the page. You've been paying for ads here through Project Wonderful and I have no problem with advertisers also using the blog and link capabilities. Anything TG is pretty much okay, that's why it's the BigCloset after all.

Blogging an ad every day or even one a week would be a bit much though, but then, you haven't done that. :)

Some of our members here get protective, perhaps fearing that links to such overt adult-oriented sites will damage the reputation or threaten the existence of this island of acceptance. But tolerance and acceptance are big wide brushes and necessarily must paint their messages in big wide strokes.

Don't anyone take either the blog or some people's responses as being offenses, no one was doing anything to be offensive - perhaps just a bit defensive. :)

Hugs to all,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Thanks, thought I put it up as a link,,

Thank you for replying Erin. Actually I really did mean to put it up as just a link in your link section. I'm still finding my way around your site. If you think it should be moved to a more appropriate place please do so, I don't want to offend anyone. Thanks for being understanding. Holiday cheer to everyone!
Betty

Erin's picture

You're right

It is a link. :)

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Just To Clarify

Betty, I do not object to sexual content on a website. I do not object to porn, either (as long as all the participants are adult humans, consenting, protected from actual harm, and properly compensated.) I despise people like John Ashcroft, and ridiculous puritanical laws like Alabama's anti-sex-toy law.

What I don't like is being told something is about crossdressing, fashion and makeup tips, and oh, has some adult content, too, only to find that the emphasis is quite different.

You may disagree with me, but I would describe the site as primarily devoted to those who fantasize about sex with men while crossdressing, or about sex with (or while being) "she-males," or about sexual humiliation and the wonderful world of sissydom. This is something different than merely crossdressing. This is not a negative value judgement on my part. I do not disapprove, even though it may not be "my thing." I only ask that things be described honestly and without artifice whenever possible.

There are many people who would love a site like yours. They deserve to know it exists, as do those who might want to give it a miss. A correctly selected audience is a happy audience!

Erin's picture

There's a problem

Crossdressing is a word with a wide-angle definition. Your definition and Betty's overlap but are not congruent. I really don't think there is intent to deceive, what would be the point? Betty's definition may actually be more inline with the mainstream definition. Maybe that's sad but most people probably do think that all crossdressers engage in all those things. From the POV of the mainstream, why else would anyone do it if it wasn't about erotic fantasy?

My definition of crossdressing is pretty broad and again, that's why this place is called the BigCloset.

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Our Lives Are Too Precious

"...most people probably do think that all crossdressers engage in all those things. From the POV of the mainstream, why else would anyone do it if it wasn't about erotic fantasy?"

Fine. You don't want to use your website to educate people about crossdressers. That's your prerogative. Maybe you don't care about crossdressers. That's your prerogative, too.

My only question is, do you seriously expect someone like me not to be at least a little concerned by this attitude?

Thankfully, politicians who serve my city are more enlightened than that, having added the strongest possible coverage for transgender people by covering all aspects of gender identity in the City's human rights law. I now have a hard-won legal right where I live, for which a large number of people before me have been abused, jailed and persecuted, to exist as a crossdresser, to present myself in public dressed opposite my birth sex, and even to use the restroom or dressing room that matches my presentation. To conflate crossdressing with sexual fetish and kink (or to fail to correct publicly held misconceptions about it) flies in the face of the very few human rights laws in this nation that offer comprehensive protection against discrimination in public accomodation, employment and housing for all transgender people.

Erin, I love you. I really do. If I didn't care, I wouldn't be challenging you to reexamine your own attitude toward crossdressers (or perhaps your indifference about others' attitudes.) Being transgender isn't one exact thing. It's an artificial consitituency defined more by what it's not than by what it is. Whether we're pre-op, post-op or non-op transsexuals, crossdressers, or anything else other than vanilla, what we are is gender outlaws in the eyes of society. If we don't insist on basic rights for all of us, and to help society learn to accept us as just another variation of normal, we do none of us any service. We had to read three times as many names at this year's TDoR than last. Let's all do what we can to fight this trend.

Erin's picture

Freedom

You want me to remove something someone else posted. You feel you have very good reason to do that. Good moral reasons. I read them, they're pretty good as such things go. But they are unconvincing to me.

Why?

Well, I've heard those before. Coming from the other end. They're the same reasons everyone has for censoring someone else.

I didn't conflate crossdressing with sexual fetish -- but some crossdressers do and probably most of the mainstream who have an opinion about it. I didn't fail to correct publicly held misconceptions about crossdressing. I've been running this site -- for people to do just that if they want to -- for nine years now. Accusing me of laxity in this fight is pointless.

I've said it here before and I will continue to say it -- morality as a reason to NOT post something leaves us with nothing to post. You want your morals to triumph here. The mainstream wants their morals to triumph and shut us down. I get moral arguments PM'ed and e-mailed to me all the time about something or other posted here. I respond politely the same way. Moral arguments about TG issues are irrelevant to what I'm doing here. I delete moral arguments when they are posted attached to a story.

Morality as a reason for censorship is bankrupt. What little redaction I do here, I do for practical reasons, to prevent flamewars and damage to the mission of this site. This is a friendly place to read, write and discuss TG fiction.

Betty's link supports that mission. How? Well, I suspect that many of the people who come here and read some of the stories here would be interested in her site. Why? Because there are a fair number of stories here that cater to that particular sensibility.

Your protestation of her post does not serve the site because you are proclaiming a moral superiority over Betty and the BC fans that likely visit her site. You're claiming that your vision of crossdressing is more legitimate than Betty's.

You don't have to like Betty's business. You don't have to patronize it. You don't even have to pretend to do those things. But if you want to come to BigCloset and read the sort of story you like that is posted here, you're going to have to live with the fact that there are people who come here who are not like you. And they probably like stories you would not like. And some of them may like the sort of thing that goes on at Betty's.

Everybody thinks that there are moral absolutes. And there are. But they don't concern what people like to read or what they do for fun with consenting adults. Those are individual judgements. And individually, each of us has the right to make those judgements and not have someone else make them for us.

I do as much as I can to protect those basic rights and others. For me those appear to be moral absolutes, I may be wrong but I don't think I am. I have a second test for moral positions -- is it ethical? Ethics are concerned with equity and fairness.

Would it be fair to Betty to ban a link to her site from here when many of the stories here feature places that at least resemble hers and text situations that are mirrored in some of her graphics? No, that would not be fair.

So since it seems both moral and ethical to me to let her post her link, and it's my judgement that really counts here, that's not completely fair but practically there's no other way to do it, her link stays.

And I have to say, this wasn't a gray area for me. Not even as close as the shaggy dog story I've gotten half a dozen private messages about. This is clearly in the realm of what is allowed under the guidelines and principles I have been operating this website on for nearly a decade.

And if the worst thing I do in my life is make someone annoyed at me for allowing someone else to post a link to kinky, adult website then I'm doing good. :)

Hugs to all,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Not Asking You To Remove

Erin, I'm not asking you to remove anything whatsoever. I'm not asking you to censor anything, either. And, this has nothing to do with morals.

If I'm asking anything, all I'm asking is for a little sympathy and permission for me to point out that crossdressing, per se, is a misunderstood phenomenon and that it's no more inherently linked to sexual kink or fetish than is transsexualism.

This is not a diatribe against sexual kink or fetishism, or whatever turns anyone's crank. Nor is it against freedom of speech or expression.

Betty described her site one way. Because you enable Top Shelf to have a comments facility, I had the opportunity to express my opinion about her description, and especially the emphasis in it. That's it. That's all I wanted. I thank you for that. I'm not asking her to do anything, either (about the message already posted.) There's nothing wrong with her website, or her promoting it here. In her promotion of it, if she hadn't downplayed the focus of the site, I wouldn't have said anything at all. I do hope if she posts further promotions of it here, she'll balance her message to match her website.

The rest of this discussion all seems to be about whether anyone should suggest that crossdressing be considered independently of fetish and kink, at least by those in our community who should be more sensitive on the subject of public animosity and discrimination.

I'm not going to repeat here the prevalent public attitude toward transsexuals to rebut or counterpoint your argument about attitudes about crossdressers. This isn't a net-sum game. All I want to say is that (attitudinally) throwing crossdressers overboard to feed the sharks is not going to make the sharks stay away.

Erin's picture

Sorry for misunderstanding you

Your position is much clearer now and I apologize for thinking it was other than it was.

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Thank You

Thank you so much for the opportunity to discuss this, and for taking the time to try to understand me. I can't tell you how much I appreciate that!

Please accept my apologies, too. I guess I can get a bit worked up at times, and I'm sorry if I upset anyone.

*hugs*

Suspicious

When somebody registers and immediately posts a blog advertising a website, you'll have to forgive me for being a bit suspicious of their motives. And the website.

KJT

"Being a girl is wonderful and to torture someone into that would be like the exact opposite of what it's like. I don’t know how anyone could act that way." College Girl - poetheather

Karen J.

* * *

Ever accidentally throw something away and then later realize you actually needed it?

I did that with my life.

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