In a quandry

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I started a story about 2 years ago and have been working on it off and on since. Lately I've been putting more effort into it as the direction of the story has evolved. I've set the story in a high school. A real high school and the protagonist is involved in one of the real groups. I'm not using any real world names; everyone is fictional. The school is being used as mostly a backdrop but the activity the central character is involved with is a real entity. I have characters using phrases used at the school. I did this because I thought it'd be fun to use a non-fictional setting. The story will only appear here on BCTS so there's no profit motive.

But! I got to thinking about it and now I'm curious if this violates any copyrights the school has for the use of its name or does this fall under fair use? The school is actually well known which is why I chose it. Nothing in the story denigrates the school. In fact, it's very positive towards the school itself. I like the idea of a real world setting, and I'd like to keep the story there instead of a fictional setting, but I don't want to be sued either.

So my question is, is this fair use?

Melanie

Comments

I don't set my TG stories in a paricular place.

Patricia Marie Allen's picture

In the other genre I write in, I set most of them in the town I grew up in. I often site names of real restaurants, and entertainment venues and other real world settings. I'm not sure of copyright for name or places. I'd say as long as you don't use or describe any printed material or the name of their mascot or school team names, then you're probably OK.

Hugs
Patricia

Happiness is being all dressed up and HAVING some place to go.
Semper in femineo gerunt
Ich bin eine Mann

If in doubt, better safe than sorry

Melanie,

If you have any doubt at all, my suggestion is, that it is better to be safe than sorry. It might be better use a different name. Maybe you can use a synonym. Or you can make a variation of the name. Or maybe there is a popular name used by the community or by former students.

Common sense would suggest that proper names can not be copyrighted. Otherwise Disney Corp. could sue the all the parents who name their child Donald, because they own the copyright for the character Donald Duck. But then again stranger things have happened in the legal arena. And the laws (and interpretations) vary from country to country.

Jessica

I've seen a lot of real names

I've seen a lot of real names of schools, towns and businesses used in stories. Look at Julie O's universe stories as an example. She uses several real places in both San Diego and in the North East, including many stories based in and around Penn State University.

Also think about how many names of places like schools are replicated throughout the country. How many Washington Elementary schools, or Central High Schools actually Exist in the United States?

So I wouldn't worry too much about using real names of places unless you are actually affiliated with or work at the place in question.

Now slogans on the other hand can be copywritten, so best to not use any school motto, fight song, etc.

We the willing, led by the unsure. Have been doing so much with so little for so long,
We are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

I would think there is an infinitesimally rare risk

of accidentally using someone's real name associated with the school as a character. If they thought the character was based on them and libled or defamed they might come after you for damages. They would probably lose in court because they would have to convince the court you wrote about and defamed them specifically. But defending from lawsuits is expensive and not fun.

I went to the source:

I went to the source:

Amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole: Under this factor, courts look at both the quantity and quality of the copyrighted material that was used. If the use includes a large portion of the copyrighted work, fair use is less likely to be found; if the use employs only a small amount of copyrighted material, fair use is more likely. That said, some courts have found use of an entire work to be fair under certain circumstances. And in other contexts, using even a small amount of a copyrighted work was determined not to be fair because the selection was an important part—or the “heart”—of the work.

Your usage may fall under this area as it's not using the copyrighted material. It's like so many movies and TV shows using the major colleges as the destinations for students, they mention the school and there are usually exterior shots, but the school isn't harmed by the minor usage of it as the school isn't the focus and as long as the school isn't looked down upon or put into a bad light there is little it can do against you.

I'm told STFU more times in a day than most people get told in a lifetime

If it helps, there are no

If it helps, there are no copyrights on names. None, zip, zero, zilch. You're looking in the wrong direction.

What they have are TRADEMARKS. The word Coca, and the word Cola, for example, are not trademarked or protected. However, the word Coca-Cola (exactly like that), and the swoosh logo are trademarked. However, Coca Cola isn't trademarked. If someone made a cocaine based soda again, then they could call it 'coca cola' and they'd be okay, as long as their name didn't _look_ like Coca-Cola's.

So, the main thing you have to worry about is that you use those names in ways that do not adversely affect their reputation. For example, if you wanted to say that a character used a Band-Aid, you can do that. if you say that they _didn't_ use Band-Aids because they always fell off, that would be a no-no. (Band-Aid is a trademark of the Johnson & Johnson corporation).

The simple way to put it is this.

1) Are you using a trademark in a way that makes the trademark look bad?
2) Are you using the trademark to make money directly off of the trademark?

If either is 'yes', then you need to not do it. If the answer is 'no' to both, you're fine. (You can have someone working at a Domino's Pizza, going to school at Hahvad, and vacationing at DisneyLand, with no problems. Have that person getting drunk with Mickey Mouse, and you're in trouble.)

Relatively recently (a few months ago) there was a breakdown on YouTube by a guy that calls himself 'youtubelaw', about a dispute with a Domino's Pizza franchisee and a person who salvaged a Domino's DXP - complete with all logos and the warming oven. It's good to listen to, because it gives a reasonably succinct explanation of how trademark applies and why.


I'll get a life when it's proven and substantiated to be better than what I'm currently experiencing.

Trademarks

Melanie Brown's picture

If anything the school is promoted. The only negative would be assuming the school would agree to go along with the crazy idea in the story. :) I made up all the names. I’ve always used real business names.

Melanie

Real names

Mel, if you had a character going to college in Boston or Cambridge, would you make up a school? No, you'd say MIT, or Boston College, so why not, say Boston Latin high school, or Ridgemont High.ect? Remembering the old Nike ad, "Just do it".

You could always use

made up names.

For example, 'Hudson University" is apparently the most dangerous place in NYC. How many TV Shows and Films have used it. It was introduced by DC Comics but it seems to have been adopted as the place where students get up to no good in the big apple.

There is even a wikipedia page dedicated to fictional educational establishments
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Fictional_universitie....

Samantha

The not selling anything is

The not selling anything is probably the most important factor. How something is depicted is too.

I mean the you do not want to be disparaging or unflattering. Copyright is only one aspect. Trademark is another that people often overlook. Even something like "Madona" can be viewed as a brand.

If it helps... I received (for an Amazon release for sale) a green light to mention Easy-Bake Oven and talk about it in a general sense from the company's legal team. I had to not speak ill of it though and couldn't use photos. In fact they said that I didn't need permission from them even though they thanked me for bothering to ask.

It sound like you would not have an issue. Since money is not an issue, a "remedy" if you ARE approached would be to amend whatever offends. You can do safe-but-sorry... rework things to avoid the name as others suggest... or (if you want to be sure) you might ask the school board for permision with a short description and even some samples if the usage.

Goid luck!

PS. I obtained permissions to use Deee-lite lyrics (which was fun to get). I removed lyrics for a Runaways song though I kept referenced (as the rights owner advised). I scrubbed lyrics and references to a Marilyn Manson song when they wanted to draw up a contract to sell me a per-book permission with rights to renew. The song would have been PERFECT in a dance club scene... but I like my anonymity (aside from not selling enough to justify it)!

Hugs,
Stacy

names have been changed to protect the innocent

I place my stories in real places. But, I invent people and businesses.

Using public names does not violate any laws, copyright or trademarks.

But, how about people that place themselves in the public eye? Are they fair game?

You can sort of get in

You can sort of get in trouble there. For example, there was a pub/restaurant called the Velvet Elvis in Houston. That was fine, but they ended up putting a Velvet Elvis _painting_ in the pub - still fine. Then someone had the idea to put Elvis' silhouette on the sign - lawsuit time. Trademark violation.

Public persona tend to have the assumption of owning the rights to their likenesses, other than parody (such as impersonators). However, if you put Morley Safer in your story, doing what he _did_ for 60 minutes, you're safe.


I'll get a life when it's proven and substantiated to be better than what I'm currently experiencing.

Use a disclaimer

The attached disclaimer is similar to ones found in common books using real places and real names like in James Patterson books. It is also similar to disclaimers used in movies, TV shows, almost every audio book and other artistic works.
DD

Disclaimer
This story is a work of fiction. Names, characters, businesses, places, events, locales, and incidents are either the products of the author’s imagination or used in a fictitious manner. Any resemblance to actual persons, living or dead, or actual events is purely coincidental.

Quandry

Melanie Brown's picture

Thanks for all the replies. Based on what I've read here, I think for now I'll keep the location. I made up names for positions like coach and principal. The final arbiter is of course, is always Erin.

Melanie

Nope

erin's picture

I can actually get in trouble for telling people what to do about stuff like that. As long as I react instead of pro-act, I'm protected from liability for this kind of thing. Reasonable protection, not complete, but good enough. So, until someone complains, I mostly let authors worry about this stuff.

Personally, for my own fiction, I make up names for things like small towns, companies and schools while going ahead and using names for big cities and well-known brands. But I don't insist on one solution for everyone.

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

School

Melanie Brown's picture

Well, I don't know. I thought it'd be fun to write a story where the setting was at an actual school. The school itself has already been featured in a book, a major motion picture and a TV show. I don't know about the book, but the movie really painted the school in a bad light. I wasn't going to put anything negative about the school in the story. It's just where the story takes place.

Melanie

Why Not?

Personally, all my characters and names are mythical. I allow my settings to be real, but nothing to tie in with anything commercial. I think when you're writing trans erotica, you should give 'the real' a wide berth.

School Name

Melanie Brown's picture

I didn't want to, but I went ahead and changed the name of the school and it's mascot. To me, using an actual place was part of the fun of the story. I'm still about 2/3 through it.

Melanie